finallyfulldailycheckin

Counting carbs/calories is a drag. Obsessive scale stepping is a recipe for despair. If you want to count something, "days on habit" is a much better metric. Checking off days on a calendar would do just fine, but if you do it here you get accountability and support. Here's how. Start a new topic in this forum called (say) "Your Name Daily Check In." Then every N day post a "reply" to that topic as to whether you stayed on habit. A simple "<font color="green">SUCCESS</font>" or "<font color="red">FAILURE</font>" (or your preferred euphemism if that's too harsh) is sufficient, but obviously you're welcome to write more if you want. On S-days just register that you're taking an S-day. You don't have to do this forever, just until you're confident you've built the habit. Feel free to check in weekly or monthly or sporadically instead of daily. Feel free also to track other habits besides No-s (I'm keeping this forum under No-s because that's what the vast majority are using it for). See also my <a href="/habitcal/">HabitCal</a> tool for another more formal (and perhaps complementary) way to track habits.

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finallyfull
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finallyfulldailycheckin

Post by finallyfull » Tue Apr 02, 2013 3:00 pm

I decided to begin a check-in (periodic, not daily) to see if it helps, and to track my progress because I have a very different feeling this time -- I think I get it. After several years of on again/off again No S'ing, I'm ready for it to be normalcy instead of a diet. So here goes:

I'm 5'8", 155 pounds, age 45. Not overweight, but I am alarmed by the easy upward creep. Calorie counting on No S is responsible for many of those pounds, as is "trying to cut back" without any particular system.

I have been on vanilla since mid-December of 2012. I think I've gained three pounds, but I'm not sure. But I feel sane and certain and my weekends are not at all over-the-top THIS time because I feel a sense of calm from eating enough, regularly, day in and day out.

One thing I know is on the horizon, when I feel comfortable and sure: I do not feel very hungry for meals, so I'm probably eating a wee bit too much (thus the gain!), and also I eat too much at dinner, which is dumb because I'm going to bed in three hours, not "lasting" for six or seven.

Changes THIS time: fruits & veggies at every meal, three good meals a day on S days, and not intentionally seeking out sweets on weekends. Also, no habitcal, because that turns it into a diet for me (i.e., if I slip and eat two olives, I'm "off the wagon" and continue stuffing.) Not this time!

Biggest change this time: I'm in for good. I feel sure it will keep off weight and it just might peel back a layer.

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Post by finallyfull » Sat Apr 06, 2013 12:37 pm

Had one red this past week, a brownie and a big toll house cookie. Next time I plan to walk by the place they are kept without looking at them.

So today is an S day and I will eat three good meals, regardless of anything else. Also no "stupid" snacking -- meaning just eating because I "can". Only if it is truly delicious.

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Post by KL » Sat Apr 06, 2013 5:56 pm

finallyfull wrote:Had one red this past week, a brownie and a big toll house cookie. Next time I plan to walk by the place they are kept without looking at them.

Also no "stupid" snacking -- meaning just eating because I "can". Only if it is truly delicious.
Excellent plan :!:
"Everything is permissible for me - but not everything is beneficial...I will not be mastered by anything." 1 Cor 6:12

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Re: finallyfulldailycheckin

Post by No BS » Sat Apr 06, 2013 9:29 pm

finallyfull wrote: Biggest change this time: I'm in for good. I feel sure it will keep off weight and it just might peel back a layer.
I am sure, too! Welcome back & good luck with your renewed commitment. :D
If you are not living life on the edge you are taking up too much room!!

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Post by finallyfull » Tue Apr 09, 2013 3:26 pm

Great weekend -- had a few treats but nothing I didn't want and nothing excessive. Managed to eat some fruit and veggies at most meals. Skipped fast food because I wasn't hungry yet and I wanted something better for myself.

I think adding fresh fruits and veggies to every meal has made a moderate but crucially important difference in many things, including my energy levels (it took several weeks to kick in), my sense of fullness, and my relationship to my body. I think I finally get that it's not only about my mouth and my size -- it's about nurturing and honoring the only body I will ever have, and doing my best to feel good. It seems to be working.

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Post by KL » Tue Apr 09, 2013 7:02 pm

finallyfull wrote: I think I finally get that it's not only about my mouth and my size -- it's about nurturing and honoring the only body I will ever have, and doing my best to feel good. It seems to be working.
Yay :!: Good for you for coming to this realization - it will serve you well. :)
"Everything is permissible for me - but not everything is beneficial...I will not be mastered by anything." 1 Cor 6:12

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Post by finallyfull » Sat Apr 13, 2013 12:49 pm

Great week! No reds. Another lesson: I did not LOOK at the dessert table. I previously looked at it just to "appreciate" it and be thankful, but turns out that's a bad idea.

I think adding freggies as one half of most meals (1-3 per meal) has started to crowd out the denser stuff. It could be my imagination, but I wake up with a flatter belly and my pants are a teensy bit less tight. Sounds small but it feels wonderful. Pulling on pants and they are a teensy bit tighter is a drag, especially when there is "no end in sight" to the slow creeping gain because you don't have a plan that you feel confident in. Now I feel totally confident -- the creep won't happen and I may just fit into them a little better, to boot!

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Post by Jonas Jonasson » Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:00 pm

Now I feel totally confident
Yahoo!
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If a person is fairly new to English their English words and expressions are influenced by their mother tongue, so things that might sound impolite to you are not always meant in that way.

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Post by finallyfull » Mon Apr 15, 2013 4:06 pm

Thought I'd leave a marker for myself here: had a great weekend, three meals per day, with a couple of stupid snacks, one enjoyable second of chilli, and a small scoop of ice cream enjoyed mindfully. Plenty of food, but it was two S days and they felt sane.

Also, weighed a bit less at the docs office today, always hard to tell because of water fluctuation, but I think I'm down a couple of pounds!

I really think the freggies and eating slowly and mindfully when I can is turning things in a good direction. I can easily live like THIS the rest of my life! (Unless I allow myself to be fooled again, but No S always seems to wait patiently for me to learn my lessons and come crawling back. It's very forgiving.)

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Post by SpiritSong » Mon Apr 15, 2013 4:42 pm

Congrats! Sounds like things are going very well. :D

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Post by finallyfull » Tue Apr 16, 2013 2:50 pm

Tuesday -- waiting longer before eating breakfast so that I could mindfully explore what my real hunger feels like. I calmed myself and took stock of exactly how my body felt, then ate a slow, enjoyable, nutritious breakfast. Now I'm paying attention to what satisfied feels like.

I was thinking "Okay when I get back to real life I may not have TIME to eat mindfully." I caught myself and decided that, if nothing else in life, I will commit to at least enjoying eating each meal for as long as I live (when I remember). If I can't do that, I am missing out on one of the main pleasures of life. Duh!

I have never been mindful of hunger on purpose before. I ate when I was hungry usually, but would never ever have "waited" until I was hungry. Now I see that when I do, the experience of eating, as well as the fullness is much more pleasurable. It's also amazing to me how often I just plain wanted to eat and thought of it as being "hungry." Self deception is so easy.

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Post by SpiritSong » Tue Apr 16, 2013 3:10 pm

Great lesson learned! Meals are so much more enjoyable when we are hungry for them, but first we have to learn not to eat at the first idea of hunger. This has definitely been one of the best lessons from No S for me.

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Post by finallyfull » Wed Apr 17, 2013 2:06 pm

Yesterday:

breakfast: steel cut oatmeal with banana & dried cranberries, coffee

lunch: big spinach salad with chicken and blue cheese dressing

dinner: one reasonable size piece of lasagne and a bunch o'broccoli

one dark beer


The struggle for me right now, and this is very important for me, is not turning this into a diet. I feel sure the last few "fails" were when I did this. I do want to find the sweet spot where I have enough but small enough to feel nice and hungry for the next meal. My body will do whatever it will. The only thing that is definitely diet-ish about this now is I am taking extra time to plan healthful meals rather than easy ones. That means chopping, washing, packing, sauteeing, steaming, going to the store for fresh things. All a pain, all things I'd do on a diet, but NOT a diet because this is how sane people treat a body they want to keep healthy for as long as possible. I may always tend to try to revert back to "easy" (grabbing a bag of pretzels instead of making a salad) but I think I am actually changing into a person who cares about my health and feels worthy of taking an extra 10-15 minutes to invest in a healthy meal. What else would I invest that time in, more money, more efficiency, more housework? Even my kids can wait: I want to be around them and healthy for as long as possible. I also want to set a good example for them.

Long post, but I plan on reading these when I feel discouraged.

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Post by SpiritSong » Wed Apr 17, 2013 2:09 pm

finallyfull wrote:The only thing that is definitely diet-ish about this now is I am taking extra time to plan healthful meals rather than easy ones. That means chopping, washing, packing, sauteeing, steaming, going to the store for fresh things. All a pain, all things I'd do on a diet, but NOT a diet because this is how sane people treat a body they want to keep healthy for as long as possible. I may always tend to try to revert back to "easy" (grabbing a bag of pretzels instead of making a salad) but I think I am actually changing into a person who cares about my health and feels worthy of taking an extra 10-15 minutes to invest in a healthy meal. What else would I invest that time in, more money, more efficiency, more housework?
Good for you! This is exactly what I need to do. What is more important than our health (and the health of our families)?

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Post by Amy3010 » Thu Apr 18, 2013 8:29 am

And once you really wrap your mind around it, it really doesn't take that much extra time to prepare healthy things, it's just an idea we had in our heads about how much effort and extra time it took. And then after a while you get to a point (at least I did) where you actually look forward to that little window of time where you prepare healthy foods for yourself and your family instead of that mad dash to just get something on the table.

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Post by finallyfull » Mon Apr 22, 2013 2:01 pm

All green last week, and I am giving myself a green for a virtual plating event where I might have had a pretty full plate if it were one plate. But I resisted many snacks earlier in the day when I felt nervous about something and had lots of food around (usually I nibble for no good reason when I'm nervous), and I didn't have any sweets.

Also wanted to note I had plenty of good stuff on the weekend, including pop tarts and ice cream. If I wind up losing any weight, I want to remind myself that I did so without deprivation. If I don't lose any, I'll know why.

But I'm not keeping my eyes on the "bottom line" right now -- just building this habit one day at a time. And enjoying it greatly, even though it's hard at times.

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Post by finallyfull » Tue Apr 23, 2013 2:19 pm

Took a NWS on Monday for my son's birthday -- mediocre cookie cake not worth it. Should have known. But I don't care, it's a legitimate S say. Did not have WTH, but I did have one icky chocolate that was offered to me later.

Without No S I really don't think I would be paying this much attention to whether or not certain things were "worth it." My standards are (at least theoretically, if not practically) getting higher and higher. Four months into this, and I can easily see that I am becoming someone who wants healthy food everyday, is worth the time and money to buy and prepare healthy food, and to only eat delicious, high quality sweets on S days.

That sounds great! Why didn't I think of this a million years ago?

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Post by finallyfull » Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:44 pm

I don't think it's my imagination -- my pants are a little looser today. Or should I say, a little less tight. :)

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Post by SpiritSong » Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:37 pm

finallyfull wrote:I don't think it's my imagination -- my pants are a little looser today. Or should I say, a little less tight. :)
Congrats! :D I am still looking forward to that day.

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Post by finallyfull » Fri Apr 26, 2013 1:32 pm

"S event" yesterday -- ate three cookies due to imaginary social pressure (someone brought them to me). Could have had one bite. Not worth it.


So today I've decided to make a new commitment to myself: I will go out of my way to break the habit of looking at calories. I have mostly stopped, but I still do now and then, and it is a bad thing for me. Not terrible, just bad. It pushes me into diet head, it interrupts the process of me considering what my body needs and wants, and it's just plain annoying. I want to choose the amount I eat for breakfast by using my built in plate-o-meter: my appetite, and my fullness feeling. I don't want to add more because I "can", or skimp on what I feel I need because I "should." I just want to choose healthful foods in the amount I need to get me to the next meal with a reasonable sense of well being, followed by anticipatory hunger.

Calories no longer exist. Any idiot knows granola in large quantities is more fattening than celery. It's all about balance.

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Post by finallyfull » Mon Apr 29, 2013 11:40 am

Did something differentish this past weekend: made sure to eat a good healthy meal both Saturday and Sunday before going to events. Normally I feel the urge to skip on weekends, because often there seems to be food wherever we go, and I imagine I'm being virtuous. All that does is disorder my eating.

This time at both events I was satisfied, and did not feel the urge to pick or eat weird combos or a bunch of sweets or anything. At one I had nothing (happily! instead of being food-focused or feeling deprived) and at the other I had two small cookies (again, happily).

Makes a big difference. Keeping the order staves off disorder.

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Post by finallyfull » Wed May 01, 2013 1:17 pm

Could be a fluke or water fluctuation, but I was down a few pounds on the doctor's scale today. That would mean that I not only reversed the couple pound gain that I gained when I started this (big plates full of dense food necessary to make the transition and feel good about it) but I am losing, ever so slowly (freggies with every meal, ensuring it's never a "diet" meal, so I can be on it for life).

This is cool! I now feel certain that next fall when I pull out my clothes, they won't be tighter like they so often have been. Whether they're too small I don't care (ok I'm trying not to care). Maintenance is progress, reduction is bonus.

I have to say that I now KNOW for certain that when I have eaten between meals most of my life, it's probably never been because I was physically hungry. Wow!! I am learning what real hunger feels like (okay, first world "real") and it's as unmistakable as having to go to the bathroom. If I have to ask myself "am I hungry" I am not hungry.

How many people wonder "hmmmm, do I have to go to the bathroom?" Nobody. We just wait until we are dancing around a little. I'm not nearly at that point with hunger, because even every 6 hours doesn't allow me to get distractedly hungry. Obviously because I have too much at meals. And I'm eating what seem like reasonable sized meals. I will maybe pare back a bit, over time, but slowly, so I don't think I'm on a diet and set up rebellion.

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Post by finallyfull » Mon May 06, 2013 4:36 pm

It's working! Down two more pounds (the trend is down, even though pounds can fluctuate alot).

I am so glad I have consistently fought my urge to turn this into a diet by shorting myself at meals, because I really very sincerely want to see what a year on three sane meals a day plus treats on special days looks like. And I can't see what it looks like if I don't do it. I've had a couple of red days, a couple of wilder S days, and three truly satisfying meals every day, and my weight is trending downward. Turns out food peace and healthy body weight are not mutually exclusive.

whenever I "catch" myself trying to eat a less than satisfying meal, I throw in a little more. Not enough to be too much, but I'm careful to aim for enough-plus a little. This is helping me listen to my body and not my stupid head. If I feel truly full, I can stop. (rarely happens). The really important thing this does for me is help me to KNOW that I can have enough, so that I can slowly short-circuit the "grass is greener" syndrome that makes me want something simply because I "can't" have it. For instance, I had a whole avocado as part of my dinner the other night. My diet head argued against it, but I'm trying to kill that voice, so I dished up the whole thing. Turns out, after about 3/4ths of it, I didn't want anymore, it was just too much avocado. Had I not "allowed" myself that whole thing, I might always imagine I had to "control" my avocado portions, and feel slighted. Now I know I can have as much as I want (okay one plate full !) but that I only WANT half or so. Good lesson.

Coming up on five months, and only about five pounds down, but I've lost another ten pounds of self-deception, and gained ten pounds of peace and sanity. Life is too short to fight food all my life. Now we are good friends. Really good friends.

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Post by finallyfull » Wed May 08, 2013 8:10 pm

Argh! Mad at myself for breaking my "don't count calories" pledge.

I ate a big bowl of grape nuts with dried cranberries today and felt really still full well after my usual lunch time. Curiosity got me, and I found I'd had like 1100 calories for breakfast -- double or triple what I probably normally have! But my body KNEW this, and I really feel it's important for ME to learn to tune into my body rather than calories or clock times, and learn to follow its rhythm. So far this has resulted in looser pants and peace of mind, but I had to go look.

I would have naturally adjusted the amount (and density!) because I really value being hungry for a nice lunch. But the numbers mess with me. They suck me into diet head, when my body just signals me gently and leaves me to live my life.

I make a new pledge to myself: no calorie counting -- just eat three plates a day when I'm hungry and eat until I'm satisfied.

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Post by finallyfull » Thu May 09, 2013 11:53 am

Without No S this would not have happened. I went to bed without eating dinner. Not because I'm on a diet, not because I'm sick, but because I wasn't hungry. A first!

I also have been reading and following Geneen Roth's food guidelines (eat when you're hungry, stop when you're satisfied, etc.) as part of this, because I am intrigued by the crazy notion of using food for other than recreation (on N days!), and I am learning alot about myself.

I take back my last post about calories -- I don't think it hurt me this time, because I was still able to listen to my body, despite having extraneous knowledge.

I am feeling peaceful and happy with food, and am getting slimmer. At the same time.

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Post by Cantab » Thu May 09, 2013 8:12 pm

[quote="finallyfull"]How many people wonder "hmmmm, do I have to go to the bathroom?" Nobody. [/quote]

A bit TMI, but I do. Sometimes I confuse being nervous with feeling like I have to pee.

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Post by childoftheking » Fri May 10, 2013 3:30 am

Finallyfull, you are an inspiration! I love the way you write. You say the things I am thinking and have trouble saying. For me one of the big differences of this and "dieting" is that I don't think about and plan out food all day long, when counting points calories etc., that seems to take up the majority of my day. With this it seems much more spontaneous and what I desire instead of what I am supposed to have. I just have to remember what you said about maintenance being success and weight loss being a bonus.

Keep going you are doing great! I too am excited to see what a year of no s looks like on me. :wink:

finallyfull
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Post by finallyfull » Fri May 10, 2013 4:27 pm

Well thank you! I understand that receiving flattery burns calories, so I doubly appreciate it!

I agree about not needing to think about it all day. Another great thing about No S, I'm finding, is that when I do think about it, I feel good! There is not the counting, the figuring out, the guilt, the worry, that other eating plans have (or, especially the "lack of" eating plan that I'm usually on.)

I'm at five months now, my muffin top still exists but it does not spill out or over, and I feel 100% sure that when I take my fall clothes out of the box in September or October, they will not have mysteriously shrunk the way they have in the past! If they have "grown" I'll take that, but I'm happy with the peaceful feeling that I have today.

childoftheking
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Post by childoftheking » Fri May 10, 2013 10:46 pm

:D

finallyfull
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Post by finallyfull » Tue May 14, 2013 11:46 am

Two red days, Friday and Monday, both not "worth" it at all -- chalk it up to learning. Friday some dumb chips because I was at a party sitting in front of the bag, and Monday a teeny plate of appetizers because everyone else was going up and I have this illogical thing about not wanting to "make" other people feel bad by not eating. Duh. Need to lose that instinct.

Enjoyed the weekend with some gusto, but not over the top. About two big handfuls of deluxe, dark chocolate covered caramels. If I can eat that on a weekend and maintain, No S is worth it right there!

Thought I'd post this so I can look back later to track what I'm up to.

Oh, I almost forgot, I also wanted to note a milestone: we had fresh baked cookies last night and I didn't even NOTICE or think about having one! That is truly new, and a sign that my habit is getting solid. I've read about some of you other people having this happen, but it didn't seem likely. This is great.

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Post by finallyfull » Mon May 20, 2013 1:30 pm

Phew -- learned "again" that no rules (i.e. weekend) leads to weird random eating patterns that don't bring peace or happiness. It was by no means wild, and yet I couldn't tell you what or how much I ate. A bite here, a half-meal there, who knows. No rhythm, no hunger.

I am not forcing myself to prematurely turn weekends into S days, but I think it will happen naturally. I am waiting for desire to increase, rather than putting in restrictions. My desire for hunger is actually growing!! Crazy. I will get there. Meanwhile Its hard to incorporate treats and snacks without throwing my schedule out of whack. This is a good learning experience.


Meanwhile I feel peaceful and happy that it's Monday. Especially because I have now really learned that when I'm anxious about something, I not only snack more, but I eat fast and don't taste it. Didn't really GET that before. Now that I can't do that, I am paying more attention to what's bothering me, and thinking about it head on, instead of concentrating on fixing my "hunger."

childoftheking
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Post by childoftheking » Mon May 20, 2013 7:13 pm

:)

finallyfull
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Post by finallyfull » Mon Jun 03, 2013 1:09 pm

5 and 1/2 months and definite change in habit! I went away for a conference out of town and was absolutely certain my habits would be gone and I'd be back to randomness. Instead, I stayed almost green (one tiny S event) the whole week! And it was very, very, very, very easy. Wow. Each day big piles of sweet rolls were available morning and afternoon, and all the conference attendees seemed to dig in as if this was normal behavior. I walked right by without even a twinge of desire! I think this not only has to do with my firm habit, but also the fact that I've been cramming my diet with lots of fruits and veggies for the past four months, so I think I am nourished in a way that has disengaged my body's call for sugar? I don't know but it was very weird and definitely real.

I can very clearly see a huge difference between this time and previous times on No S. When I counted calories I lost quickly, but my body seemed to rebound all on it's own and cause cravings and almost autopilot eating. This time there is no "other shoe" to drop -- I am completely satisfied because I'm eating enough and eating well.

Having said that, I did have a couple of S events the prior week, and a slightly over the top weekend, but nothing crazy.

oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Mon Jun 03, 2013 2:27 pm

I wish eating speed was the issue. I've been the slowest eater at the table for about 20 years. Sigh. But I haven't given up on untying this knot. It will just take time. TX! :)
Count plates, not calories. 10 years "during"
Age 67
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8
3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux
6/21 22

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

finallyfull
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Post by finallyfull » Wed Jun 05, 2013 2:01 pm

Ok, five and a half months in, and I am feeling unhappy that my weight is staying the same (I've lost five pounds over the time, after gaining).

But, unlike the last dozen times, this time I still think No S is the way to go, and I am grateful for it. I know I need to let go of any weight goals in order to remain free -- free from any guilt over eating, free from worry about gain, free from pulling out my pants from last season and finding them too small, free from focusing on calories, fat, scales or cutting back, so that I can enjoy healthful food, enjoy occasional treats, and be done with it.

No S has really helped me consider what's on my plate, and as a result I am eating so much healthier and enjoying food so much more. Mathematically speaking, I think I will shrink a bit over the next couple of years, because I've dumped some bad, joyless habits. But even if I stay just as I am, it's still a bargain.

I still think about food, but it is only positive now = what shall I have? What will taste good? What will keep my full? What is the healthiest thing? How can I make it healthier? Gone are the thoughts like this: I should go on a diet. Oh, I hope I don't get bigger. How could I have let this happen? I need to eat right now because I'm nervous. I shouldn't have this, but I will, just this time, but I'll feel bad about it. I ate too much yesterday, I better cut back today. I feel deprived because of my thought of cutting back, so just for this one time, I'm going to eat more. My pants don't fit. But I bought them because the previous ones no longer fit. Food is my enemy.

I have never gone this long on No S before, but the benefits are much greater than I thought, and so far I haven't even seen much of the "expected" benefit. And maybe that's because I'm not really overweight despite my muffin top. Maybe this is what healthy looks like on me at this age. Whatever it turns out to be (and I won't really know for a couple of years) -- I'm sticking with this awesome habit.

childoftheking
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Post by childoftheking » Wed Jun 05, 2013 2:14 pm

Go get 'em! I am excited to watch you and your healthy attitude continue to grow. You are an inspiration. :D

oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Thu Jun 06, 2013 12:13 am

If there are no health issues associated with your muffin top, it sounds like you have a pretty good trade-off. The odds of finding something else that will get you slimmer without a lot more micromanaging aren't very good. Only you can know if it's worth the search.

But it's be nice to have a diet-free summer, no?
Count plates, not calories. 10 years "during"
Age 67
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8
3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux
6/21 22

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Fri Jun 21, 2013 8:25 pm

Six month check-in, longest stretch by far, and definitely seeing a seemingly positive and permanent change in habit!

After two big tests, a camping trip and then a very long week-long driving trip, I have never eaten between meals, and only very rarely (whenever I wanted!) had sweets or seconds. The one time I had seconds I greatly regretted it due to an overly full stomach. The sweets were nice and well chosen.

Here's the weird part: I thought people at this stage were probably just talking themselves into the idea that it was easy and better to live like this. Now that I'm doing it, I see that it really IS easier and better. Had to see it for myself. I have truly learned to both desire and almost NEED to be truly hungry for meals. I don't WANT to spoil my appetite. Also, on S days (and I consider vacation days S days) when I know I can have whatever I want, I want less.

This could really be a great thing. And yes, still not much flesh lost, but now that I'm taking my eyes (ok, trying to pry my eyes) off of that dubious goal, I am appreciating the healthy body that I have.

oolala53
Posts: 9782
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2008 1:46 am
Location: San Diego, CA USA

Post by oolala53 » Sat Jun 22, 2013 12:46 am

Breakthrough alert! so sweet.
Count plates, not calories. 10 years "during"
Age 67
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8
3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux
6/21 22

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Thu Jun 27, 2013 12:12 pm

Checking in to remind myself I AM NOT ON A DIET. The only way this will work long term is if I can turn it into unconscious habit and quit trying to lose weight. Otherwise I will rebound one day and decide it's not worth it. That doesn't mean I will stuff myself, it just means I must lose the focus I sometimes fall into about how to cut more out of my meals.

The reason this is on my mind is that I went without breakfast yesterday, both because I think I might be a natural two meal a day person eventually, and because I have read up on intermittent fasting and was intrigued by the potential health and mental benefits (still am). But then today I was thinking too much about whether I should skip dinner, or have a lighter breakfast, and I know for sure that for me, moving fast before I am ready will give me diet head.

Some great things I learned with my breakfast experiment (didn't eat till 2:30) were that I am definitely quite easily able to go 18 hours without eating, no problem, and therefore going 6 between meals is a very reasonable thing to ask of my body. I also learned that I currently eat more than I am physically hungry for.

However, I'm focusing on Vanilla. I've reached the important goal of almost all green days. My next goal is to focus less on food unless it's to plan, prepare, or eat meals. When I have really let go of the idea of a diet, I might do a fast maybe a couple times a month. This is a new idea for me, but it's very intriguing. Not for weight loss, but for health and well being. As long as it doesn't pull me into a stupid diet and throw the rest of my healthy eating patterns out of whack.

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Wed Jul 03, 2013 12:29 pm

Several red days lately -- not sure how many, I don't count or track because that makes it a diet for me. On the positive side, zero of them turned into the "what the hell" effect. Also, I was amazed to realize that I am not only not at all hungry (usually, with the occasional transient pang) anymore for about five hours after a meal, but I really have a strong habit of not snacking. I had some candy at work that I easily would have eaten (guiltily) before, but yesterday I was both full from breakfast and it would have felt weird to eat it and to spoil my lunch.

The red days are because it's summer, I have a guest, it feels "vacationey" and so when people are having a treat I sometimes want to join in to feel the mood. But way, far less than I would have before. I bet next summer the impulse will be lessened, just due to reinforced habits.

I had a moment of annoyance yesterday at my teeny weight loss (5 pounds in 6 months, averaged) but am holding onto the fact that I had been creeping UP in weight prior to NO S (and a little after) so it truly is progress.

The most reassuring thing to me right now is that I do not seem to have any rebound impulse, because I am well fed. Previously, there would come a tipping point where my body seemed to flip a switch and say "okay, I'm taking it all back now." That's the best part of this, I think.

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Wed Jul 03, 2013 12:32 pm

Also important to me: I have been eating very healthily for the past several months -- freggies with each meal -- and I have fallen from that due to vacation/summer/laziness related reasons -- and I have the reassurance of knowing I am STILL on No S, and that there is no penalty. I can take vacations from any eating plan my mind devises, and still have the peace of knowing I will not unknowingly creep up to the next size up (and the next....)

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Wed Jul 10, 2013 1:56 pm

Coming up on seven months -- it's pretty easy now. I am enjoying reading the discussion board posts as usual, but now I am struck by how the dilemnas and questions of newbies reveal how I used to think! I am amazed that the most reasonable guidelines feel like a huge threat in our crazy random-eating culture. Also, it's probably a signpost as to how weird diets are -- people are always looking for the "catch" or strict "other" rules instead of just three squares a day.

How did I ever think random snacking would not pack on pounds? How did I never value getting really hungry for each meal? How did I treat meals like drive-by face-stuffings instead of enjoying them? How did I think "cutting back" was a plan? Because in the U.S. today and increasingly elsewhere, we have totally forgotten and devalued the need for strong, consistent cultural expectations of moderation, instead setting up a world where it's either no rules or weird new rules. It seems only a few (Thanks rinehardt!!) have even noticed that we could just look back a few decades and undo the silliness.

Whew!!

oolala53
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Location: San Diego, CA USA

Post by oolala53 » Thu Jul 11, 2013 6:40 am

Not to be mean, but don't you want to tell newbies just to try not to even think about it for a few months? They look for results and changes after only a few days. That's left over from diet head.

It's too bad when we have to practically invent our own tribe to reinforce moderation. But then again, at least we're not still lost.
Count plates, not calories. 10 years "during"
Age 67
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8
3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux
6/21 22

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Thu Jul 11, 2013 4:51 pm

I don't think it's mean at all -- but it might be impossible. You are right, diet head is hard to compete with. So we can tell them, but it's like having a whole new group of first graders come in for the first time each year -- they need to learn to read first, then move on to whatever. I guess learning that focusing on quick weight loss and thinking of 'cravings" as serious business is just what comes with the territory.

I think those who are ready come find the long-timers and read up. That's eventually what I did, and once I got the "long-term" part, and was truly convinced that diets are super dumb and damaging, I was ready.

Newbies are good for old-timers because they remind one of where we begin. I hope to be a long-timer. I will be one. I'm done with the modern random joyless, guilt-ridden, fat-inducing permasnack. Three moderate meals a day for me, and I truly have Special days now.

You have been such a help. We will grow in numbers, and no longer in girth.

oolala53
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Location: San Diego, CA USA

Post by oolala53 » Fri Jul 12, 2013 7:23 pm

Yes, I just have to accept who newbies are. I am reminded so much of myself from years ago. I actually did get some of these messages back in the late 70's and I just couldn't accept it and put it all together. I'm reminded on Geneen Roth constantly having to get women to accept that diets were unlikely to work, so it really made sense to give them up. And the women would say, well okay, I'll give them up after the next one, the one that will get me to lose 10 lbs and then I'll give them up. Good luck!
Count plates, not calories. 10 years "during"
Age 67
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8
3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux
6/21 22

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Wed Jul 17, 2013 1:10 pm

About 7 months now (never sure of the starting date). Almost completely automatic! So easy! Not only on N days, but carrying over to S days.

I've had windows of slight difficulty, but I tried to just let it roll past, and it did.

I love the daily rhythm of three moderate meals. Seven months since a moment of angst at how much I might gain. Still fighting a culture-bred desire to be smaller, which I consider a very important fight. I am at a healthy weight, and my body knows it. So what if it's a couple sizes above what it used to be.

I aim for a freggie heavy lifestyle, and had pizza for lunch yesterday. BIG difference in energy levels! I was sleepy despite a very great night of sleep. I will save pizza for dinnertime in the future.

I Love that No S is taking my focus off the stupidity treadmill and putting it where it belongs: healthy, energy, and the rest of my life.

oolala53
Posts: 9782
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2008 1:46 am
Location: San Diego, CA USA

Post by oolala53 » Wed Jul 17, 2013 2:24 pm

Stupidity treadmill. Good one.
Count plates, not calories. 10 years "during"
Age 67
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8
3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux
6/21 22

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Fri Jul 19, 2013 2:45 pm

Want to mark this for my future perusal: the other day I "naturally" had two meals, because I followed my hunger, and because 7 months of no s has taught me that not eating for a few hours is truly, truly, truly NO BIG DEAL. And it wasn't!

I had a late breakfast at like 10:30 because that's when I was hungry. Then I was busy and not hungry at my usual lunchtime of 3:00 ish, so I put it off without any anxiety until later, which turned out to be 6:30, because I knew I'd be in meetings and busy. At 6:30, I ate my meal, and I allowed myself the thought that if I got hungry, I could eat "dinner" later. But I honestly never got hungry again, even though I knew I had a free ticket for some recreational food consumption.

I feel really good about this. No S has given me months and months of practice seeing that I can go six or eight hours without eating and have zero consequences except maybe a smaller waist. Freedom! Had I been calorie counting or some other diety thing, I would have eaten later because I was allowed. Or I would have expected "results" from skipping it. But because I am trying to eat only when hungry or absolutely necessary (because hunger is coming and I'll be busy), I am connected with my body's needs.

Most amazing: that I have been BRAINWASHED for so many years into thinking I needed to eat all the time. And because of that I have enjoyed my meals far less, enjoyed my snacks with a side of guilt, and was not free to celebrate each wonderful meal and every deserved "dessert" as the blessing that it truly is. No S has unblinded me to my blessings.

Did I say anything about weight or size? NO. No S is much bigger than that. My brainwashed inner voice still has her eyes on it, but her voice is getting smaller and less significant. I am today a person who eats when she's hungry, has treats on S days, and greatly enjoys every bite in the comfort of knowing I have escaped the Matrix and won't snack and diet my way up and down the scale for the next few decades. I have arrived at the place I will gratefully stay. In gratitude and peace.

Boy I'm long winded.

oolala53
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Location: San Diego, CA USA

Post by oolala53 » Fri Jul 19, 2013 6:48 pm

Escaped the Matrix! Golden. I never saw the movie, but I can imagine.

Glad for your experience and still want to say take it a few days or weeks at a time. I've gone through some times of little hunger and then had the pendulum swing. But the lessons you've had are definitely gems and will bring you back.

Isn't it interesting that the 3 o'clock meal is dropping? Just like so many who start by giving themselves the option of a 4th small meal in the late afternoon. It rarely lasts as a need. but there's not much need in pushing it from the beginning. Let the adjustment happen naturally! No need to make it harder than it has to be.

I'm moving the rest of my post to my check-in because I'm ending up hi-jacking yours!
Count plates, not calories. 10 years "during"
Age 67
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8
3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux
6/21 22

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

Imogen Morley
Posts: 1022
Joined: Sun Mar 21, 2010 1:11 pm

Post by Imogen Morley » Fri Jul 19, 2013 7:04 pm

I really enjoy reading your thread and insights about No S. Keep it up and congratulations on your progress!

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Sat Jul 20, 2013 2:08 pm

Thank you, you nice people!

I notice this change in myself, which occurred through sticking with habit:

A long, slow change. When I started No S, saying "No" to a sweet, snack, or second, involved a kind of long decision, longing, thinking about it, and then a slightly painful act of will. I would see a table of sweets, go look at it, fight my inner gobbler, actually weigh the pros and cons, and then, sufferingly, walk away, usually.

Fast-forward 7 months, and through several phases of change, I now walk straight past the table, am still aware of it, feel a fraction of a second's pull, and do not consciously DECIDE anything. The tug, the slight pain, the willpower, is no longer part of the process. (usually).

I guess that's what Rinehart means by saying it gets easier. It sure does!

finallyfull
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Post by finallyfull » Tue Jul 23, 2013 11:54 am

Two meals yesterday, was without any effort at all, and fit my day much better. Zero hunger in the 8 hours in between. I can see that this will fit my schedule better on some days, and kind of frees me up.

Gave up milk in my coffee last week as an experiment, too. I wouldn't stop drinking coffee even if I put dirt in it, so it's not like I'm giving it up. I never notice after the first sip, so I'm thinking it's a very easy cut that might add up.

Minor, minor natural tweaks. Why? Because even though I have more blessings and more important things than weight loss from No S, I have to admit I still wouldn't mind shaving off a little bit of weight if it doesn't push me into a diet. If not, also o.k.

finallyfull
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Post by finallyfull » Thu Jul 25, 2013 1:55 pm

First time in many months that I had a big distracting hankering for food between meals yesterday! I came out green, but I have not felt that in a long time. I think it was from two possible causes: one, I had only two meals the day before, effortlessly, but maybe my body was trying to make up for lost time? (or my mind?), or, secondly, I did not have a planned lunch, and wound up waiting eight hours and still having to plan it on the fly, and by then I was hungrier than usual? So I ate lunch around 4:30 and was very anxious for dinner at 7. Weird! I held on, ate nothing in between (whoop de do, two and a half hours, yet it was hard) and then was full after dinner at 7.

I bet it was the combination of the two factors that did it. It gave me an appreciation for how far I've come, a sympathy for newbies (I need to go support them -- this IS hard at first) and reinforces the notion that I need to go slowly and gently into any changes such as two meals (for instance, make sure I eat three good planned, scheduled meals the following day for awhile.)

oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Thu Jul 25, 2013 11:58 pm

The body can definitely react to perceived famine by getting you to eat more later. That's why experienced fasters say that it's harder to come off the fast than stay on it.

I tried a 24-hour fast this week and cracked at 23 hours after feeling very antsy for food for 6 hours. I still felt antsy two hours after I finished my regular-sized meal and decided to go ahead and eat an extra salad with some avocado. So, two meals in less than three hours. My eating has been okay since then. I was considering trying for a 16-hour fast from last night until today, but balked because it's only my fourth day back at work and only my second day with students. I didn't want to risk it.
Count plates, not calories. 10 years "during"
Age 67
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8
3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux
6/21 22

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

User avatar
keriamon
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Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 9:19 pm

Post by keriamon » Tue Aug 06, 2013 8:52 pm

I think your weight sounds good for your height. You probably aren't losing any more weight because your body has hit its comfort zone (the size it wants to be). But if things look too flabby for you, why not try some crunches and other exercises meant to tone up the midsection? We lose muscle mass as we age, so we have to work harder to keep looking the same as when we were younger. (The Shovelglove exercises are good for bellies; look at Reinhard's!)

But, even if you're just holding still, your peers are, on average, steadily gaining weight, so, relative to them, you're getting thinner! Imagine in another decade of doing nothing but No-S, everyone will be jealous of how thin you are.

Keep it up! :D
Current size: 18 U.S.
Goal size: 14 U.S.

finallyfull
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Post by finallyfull » Tue Aug 06, 2013 11:52 pm

Keriamon,

You are right -- I am at a healthy weight, and I cannot complain! In fact, No S has helped me to get to a very peaceful place, which really goes against all the media efforts to make me feel bad about my body. The reason I found No S in the first place was because I have, for the past few years, continually felt deprived and tried to "cut back" while steadily but slowly gaining. The combo of feeling unsatisfied and slightly gaining made me mad. I wanted to be sure not to "accidentally" gain five pounds a year, and maybe, just maybe, return to my smaller size. But what I found was that I am 'finally full" -- I no longer fight always feeling like I'm cutting back, because I eat three good meals instead of six stupid ones, plus bites of everything else.

I still fight a silly desire to be at my skinny weight, but I really do know that is dumb and beside the point. I still have it! But I've come such a long way, and I have peace with food. and I am really happy to know that I won't pull out my pants this fall and find them tighter.

I do sometimes feel bad for being on this board when I'm not overweight. But the point for me is that I was HEADED that way (I have siblings that slowly got larger and larger, and friends, too. I could stand getting larger if I felt really satisfied most of the time, but what a rip off to gain weight and feel deprived at the same time!)

Tessytwinkle
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Post by Tessytwinkle » Wed Aug 07, 2013 6:38 am

Dear Finallyfull

you said 'I do sometimes feel bad for being on this board when I'm not overweight'

But I am so glad you are posting on this board. I am a newbie and your journey is so encouraging. We are all trying to establish a good relationship with food. Some of us are trying to lose a lot of weight - i need to for my health. But really it is all about eating well and changing a lifetime of bad eating. That is why it s so important for me and others to hear that you are 'finally full'!!! And that you are at peace with food. This made me feel like crying. I want this so badly. Thank you for sharing :? Good luck and please keep posting, I want to hear about the moment when you get out your pants in the fall and they are just right rather than too tight!
Tessy

finallyfull
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Post by finallyfull » Wed Aug 07, 2013 12:05 pm

:D

Hippy Dippy
Posts: 52
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Location: Denver, CO

I agree with Tessywinkle!

Post by Hippy Dippy » Wed Aug 07, 2013 2:43 pm

Hey, Finallyfull!

I agree with Tessywinkle. I am also a newbie (Day 38 ). I am middle-aged and have 50 pounds to go (ish). Your posts give us proof that we are on the right track.

My weight has been creeping up on me for years--there's the losing it with WW, then gaining it back. Then there's Atkins--losing it partially, then gaining it back. I also did not like feeling deprived and being told the multi-processed-carbs-have-been removed-and-sugar-replaced-with-chemicals foodstuffs and fat-removed foods were "healthier" for me. And I couldn't believe a billion Chinese were wrong if they didn't have a rampant obesity pandemic. I found it all so confusing and wrong somehow. But I did not know where to go. No S is that island of sanity in an ocean of panic-stricken swimmers whose only accomplishment was finding a floaty to keep their heads above water.

Anyways, I need to keep reading about others who have gone before me and have accomplished so much and are still doing so!

Thanks!
Hippy Dippy
Moderation in all things...including moderation
Start: 205.4. Current 202.2 (-3.2 lbs)

Kittykat150
Posts: 192
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Post by Kittykat150 » Thu Aug 08, 2013 11:32 am

Finally full,
I am also in a healthy weight range. Looking to be on the skinny side of normal. And if I reach that skinny after a year of NoS, bravo for me. But if I stay in this higher weight range and enjoy my life free from "fat head", it is worth it. I have never felt so peaceful about food and fat and my middle aging.
Keep up the posts. I am watching you!
Kat :wink:
"Never give up, for that is just the place and time that the tide will turn." -Harriet Beecher Stowe

finallyfull
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Post by finallyfull » Sat Aug 17, 2013 1:15 pm

Eight month check-in: amazing. In many ways, I'm not me! For instance, yesterday I found myself at 4:45 in the afternoon realizing I hadn't had lunch, nor was I particularly hungry!? I had a good but not over the top breakfast around 10:30. Eight months ago I would have freaked out if I had to wait until noon for lunch -- even if I had snacked!

I guess what this means to me is I truly have become peaceful with food. Because I'm eating at regular but well-spaced intervals, I just don't think of it as much because I'm out of the HABIT!

I am not losing, nor gaining weight at this point. My clothes are a wee bit looser than they had been, and I feel slimmer, somehow. I greatly enjoy my three meals a day. I have made them healthier just because I have to look at them and know "that's it" so I can't be in denial that I will somehow make up for it. My weekends are enjoyable and not usually wild. They are sometimes, and I'm ok with that.

In the past, when dieting, I would suddenly become very interested in desserts and candy. Last week on Saturday I was in a store and decided to treat myself to some chocolate. But I didn't want any! I was full and knew I could have it, but had zero desire. I bought my husband and kids some celebratory ice cream the other night, and passed up one myself with zero effort. Totally peaceful. On the other hand, I recently had a big fat ice cream sundae and enjoyed it thoroughly. I am choosy because I am at peace and I want the best!

I know keriamon is right, the only health effort I need to make right now is shovelglove. I choose to keep that effort totally separate from eating, because I don't want to accidentally take on diet head.

Bottom line: I am cured. I gladly accept rules in our rule-less society because they make me happy. For the next few decades, if I live that long, I will enjoy food and stay slim instead of warring with food and slowly gaining. All I had to do was let go of the fairy tale of snacking my way slimmer, and pretending all snacks, sweets and seconds were "just this once," when they were the order of the day.

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lpearlmom
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Post by lpearlmom » Sat Aug 17, 2013 2:28 pm

Yay congrats on getting to such a great place with food. sadly if you're a woman in this society, that's no easy task!

I've been dieting since I was 10 really up & down with my weight as an adult. Ranging from 115-210. Fat or thin though, I've never had peace with food till now. It's only been a couple of weeks for me but this plan is truly such a blessing for my emotional state.

Hopefully the physical part will follow for me too. Thank you for sharing your journey.

Linda
Put in reasonable, sustainable perimeters on your eating and exercise and then get on with the rest of your life.


“Don't let people tell you who you are. You tell them who you are.” Shyamala Goplan Harris








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oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Sun Aug 18, 2013 6:30 am

I'm convinced that part of feeling heavy is frequent eating with little hunger. When I get hungry, I feel thinner!
Count plates, not calories. 10 years "during"
Age 67
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8
3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux
6/21 22

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Sun Aug 18, 2013 2:23 pm

Good point! Frequent eating with little hunger -- that about sums up me prior to No S.

Tessytwinkle
Posts: 610
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Post by Tessytwinkle » Sun Aug 18, 2013 10:06 pm

Wow, your eight month check in is awesome. So brilliant to hear you feel 'cured' I am so delighted for you and thank you again for giving me so much hope. I have 40 lbs that I must lose for my health. But on the way I want to become calm, at peace and easy around food. Thank you for sharing
Tessy

jw
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Post by jw » Sun Aug 18, 2013 11:23 pm

Finallyfull, you are such a role model! I love the way you approach this -- and as for being normal weight on the boards, isn't that what we all aspire to? to be normal weight with normal eating patterns? You are where we all want to be, and it is so encouraging to see you there, beckoning us on! Congratulations!
"The second you overcomplicate it is the second it becomes the thing for which it is a corrective." -- El Fug

finallyfull
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Post by finallyfull » Wed Aug 28, 2013 2:45 pm

Ha! Two red days, one on Friday, the next on Monday. That's what I get for bragging!!

I think on both occasions I deliberately used food to calm myself. No, I don't think -- I did it. It wasn't much -- but it was ironic that it came after such a long stretch of green, green green.

Mark it and move on. Also I need to focus in on what's bothering me and soothe IT instead of drugging my feelings with carbs. My feelings matter, and they are trying to tell me something other than "eat".

oolala53
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Location: San Diego, CA USA

Post by oolala53 » Thu Aug 29, 2013 10:45 pm

It's not bad to learn to come back from fails, either. And your ratio of successes to fails is still pretty darn good!
Count plates, not calories. 10 years "during"
Age 67
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8
3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux
6/21 22

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Mon Sep 16, 2013 3:05 pm

9 months now. THREE red days last week -- too many reds lately -- I blame a spike in stress (both S's) due to unusual circumstances as well as a long weird slight sickness (S's). I refuse to sweat it. I am being gentle with myself, and that is why this time, unlike previous times, I will not "fall off the wagon". I will mark it and move on.

I obviously need work on comforting myself in other ways, though. I thought I was good at it, but I see I am not. Food for thought.

Anyway, yay nine months. Two months gaining a bit, seven months losing (7 months = 7 pounds -- a comforting trend.)

Supereasy changes I've made: adding freggies, black coffee, chewing more, remembering my last meal, and enjoying having an appetite.

Silly "hangers-on" that I would like to see gone from my S days: eating to the point of discomfort, eating sweets that are not worthy of me, skipping healthy foods to save room for crap, eating between meals and having no appetite. That's about it. Those things bug me in ways that have absolutely nothing to do with weight. They are lifestyle issues, some induced by No S, but which I think will go away, mostly, over time as I learn to listen to (and respond to!) my body's signals.

I hope to have seen some progress on this list by my one-year, but if not, then so be it.

Peace

oolala53
Posts: 9782
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2008 1:46 am
Location: San Diego, CA USA

Post by oolala53 » Tue Sep 17, 2013 11:30 pm

All the things that bug you bugged me for a LONG time, except that I would rarely forgo healthy food for crap ( I would forgo all eating later because I was still to dang full), but I stuck to N days. That still happens. But most of the rest of it is small potatoes now. Which reminds me: I might have roast potatoes tonight! Weather is a little cooler.

Keep going. And if on an S day, you get a whim to wait an hour or two more between snacks than you normally would, or decide to skip a sweet or eat only half a rich meal, do it. Don't believe it has to be your new modus operandi all the time. Try it out. Eventually, if it rewards you with better feelings later, your longing for those will grow. But it can take longer than you want.
Count plates, not calories. 10 years "during"
Age 67
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8
3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux
6/21 22

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

automatedeating
Posts: 4990
Joined: Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:16 pm

Thank you for sharing your journey!

Post by automatedeating » Mon Sep 23, 2013 2:03 am

Finally full, I just read through all your check in posts and you have really inspired me! Thanks for taking the time to share your journey, I can say for sure it has helped strengthen my commitment to No S and moderate eating...... Also especially noticing how often I want to eat and yet, when I examine the feeling, realize I am not hungry at all.
Thank you.
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Mon Sep 23, 2013 3:20 pm

Great weekend to report! On Saturday I very naturally and without any planning whatsoever ate two moderate meals! No S's at all. I just got busy after a late breakfast, and the next thing I knew it was 5 and almost dinner time. We went to a restaurant, and I ate slowly and savored my food, and when I got full, I did NOT press on and keep "one more bite"ing myself into overfullness, I peacefully and happily quit and put the rest in a box. What's up with that? Guess I'm changing.

On Sunday I had a normal day too, but with a small cupcake and then I had a small shake. I used to get the large because "I could" but would feel overfull. It's no big deal at all that I picked a small shake in the scheme of things, but what's big to ME is that it was TRULY what I wanted, not what I "should" have. I moderated because I WANTED to. And at the end of the shake, I was still a little fuller than I'd like, but I drank it slowly and savored it. That is a far cry from when I zipped through a large shake because I had "saved" the calories. Also, I love the idea that in having a chocolate shake, I feel like I did something positive for myself. Funny.

Here's to a green week of moderate but delicious eating and girly-skillet-shovelglove for five days. :)

oolala53
Posts: 9782
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2008 1:46 am
Location: San Diego, CA USA

Post by oolala53 » Mon Sep 23, 2013 6:06 pm

Sweet!
Count plates, not calories. 10 years "during"
Age 67
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8
3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux
6/21 22

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Fri Oct 18, 2013 2:20 pm

well I have taken a vacation from caring about moderation while grieving the loss of my dad. I made a conscious decision to focus on nurturing myself and doing whatever I feel I need to do to be comforted. Since I don't have a binge problem, it is more just eating comfort foods at whatever time I need comfort. It's not constant -- I am reaching out for the right kinds of comforts mostly -- friends, family, a good cry, prayer, listening to music that helps, whatever. But if I want saltines at 3:00 with my tea, I'm having it. And if I don't feel up to planning lunch, I allow myself to snack on whatever, when I get hungry. I can already see that in three weeks, I have mainly stuck with three regular meals, so my habits are carrying me through. I trust when I feel strong enough to get more strict, No S will be there for me. Meanwhile my 9 months of habit have allowed me to feel peaceful about this. So I'm not "off the wagon" -- I'm just allowing myself S events whenever I want, for a little while.

jw
Posts: 844
Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 7:27 pm
Location: PA

Post by jw » Fri Oct 18, 2013 2:47 pm

I am very, very sorry to hear of your loss, finallyfull. You are taking care of yourself, and that's the main thing right now. You have already developed strong habits -- let this self-nurturing be a positive for you at an otherwise sad time.
"The second you overcomplicate it is the second it becomes the thing for which it is a corrective." -- El Fug

oolala53
Posts: 9782
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2008 1:46 am
Location: San Diego, CA USA

Post by oolala53 » Sat Oct 19, 2013 4:19 am

My sympathy for your loss.

In terms of eating, I think you'll be fine.
Count plates, not calories. 10 years "during"
Age 67
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8
3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux
6/21 22

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Wed Oct 30, 2013 1:40 pm

Back in the saddle this week with no problem at all. I don't actually think I veered very much off course, thanks to habit. But in the two days so far I have had zero problem turning down the ubiquitous halloween candy, and am feeling very peaceful about putting the boundaries back up.

I am CERTAIN if I had been on some diet I would have rebounded and gained a bunch of weight and would definitely not be ready to return to diet-mode now. But since it's not a diet, and I know for sure that I will enjoy food MORE, it's an easy transition.

Love No S.

Tessytwinkle
Posts: 610
Joined: Sun Dec 09, 2012 9:14 pm

Post by Tessytwinkle » Wed Oct 30, 2013 1:48 pm

You are so impressive, I love reading your posts. To be so gentle with yourself and not be afraid of eating according to your deepest needs is very powerful. I am so sorry for your loss and thinking of you. But very glad to hear you feel at peace with yourself and now gently putting your NoS boundaries back up - that is a very special thing to read, thank you, it will help me (and others) to trust in this way of being.

Tessy

automatedeating
Posts: 4990
Joined: Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:16 pm

Post by automatedeating » Wed Oct 30, 2013 11:21 pm

finallyfull--like Tessy, I really admire how you took care of yourself. Good stuff.
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Thu Oct 31, 2013 4:10 pm

Thank you, you nice people!

Well Happy Halloween!! It's definitely an S day for me! I thought about holding my candy for the weekend, but who am I kidding.

:D

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Thu Oct 31, 2013 4:49 pm

Ha! Caught myself. I was about to open the fridge and eat a hunk of cheddar cheese just for the fun of it, because I've declared it an S day, but I quickly decided that the only reason I declared this an S day was so that when candy was presented to me, I could eat it. For instance, when I'm trick or treating with the kids, I can snack on any candy bars they offer, or I can have a few while handing out candy, or if someone has some kind of festive dessert or appetizer at the thing I'm going to, I can have that if it looks good -- stuff like that. For me, I have decided that it is NOT license for a WTH day -- that wasn't the point of making it an S day, so I'm not doing it.

I hope to take the WTH out of all my S days eventually, but I'm not hurrying. Don't want backlash.

jw
Posts: 844
Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 7:27 pm
Location: PA

Post by jw » Thu Oct 31, 2013 5:13 pm

Good for you, finallyfull! I forgot about Halloween until I read this morning's posts -- no trick or treat age kids in my life and no treats in the house at the moment -- and the one party I am attending is not until Saturday.

So I am going to N it today -- if I completely forgot it, how"S"pecial can it be, right? I could go get a chunk of cheddar out of the fridge -- but as you say, why would I want to do that?
"The second you overcomplicate it is the second it becomes the thing for which it is a corrective." -- El Fug

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Fri Nov 01, 2013 1:37 pm

Wow JW, I hadn't noticed your tag line before but it's great! It perfectly sums up most of the newbie questions about No S, which I totally had myself way back when. They can pretty much be summed up as: Can I continue to find ways to consistently overeat and still lose weight? Or, can I turn this into a diet?

Vanilla for me, please.

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Fri Nov 01, 2013 1:39 pm

Oh -- glad I called yesterday an S day -- just eating some candy ruined my whole rhythm, I forgot to eat lunch, then ate it just before dinner, and before I knew it I ended my day eating a McDonalds McDouble just before bed, because it was there. Did not feel good at all.

Lesson? S days are necessary, if only to teach me how crappy it feels to live without cultural norms around food. (Unless you call stuffing your face at will "cultural norms" which I guess they are here in the modern U.S.)

jw
Posts: 844
Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 7:27 pm
Location: PA

Post by jw » Fri Nov 01, 2013 5:08 pm

El Fug doesn't post often, but the posts are great!

And yesterday, I succumbed to the idea that everybody else was having an S day, so I had a couple of ounces of candied ginger after dinner and did not count it as a fail!
"The second you overcomplicate it is the second it becomes the thing for which it is a corrective." -- El Fug

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Mon Nov 04, 2013 2:52 pm

I think, I hope, I hit bottom yesterday when I went to bed early because my stomach hurt. I never even ate "too much" at any one sitting, but apparently I ate enough little nothings to add up to way too much or way the wrong combo. Gross!

I am not condemning or criticizing myself. I am asking myself to please, please love me more by loving my body. I am done with disorder on S days, my body cannot function with it, I cannot enjoy my life or contribute to my family if I don't feel good.

I think what has happened is that when I used to eat randomly, I somehow knew how to regulate it, but with No S I'm used to having more at meals to get me to the next meal, so the combo is painful! And totally unnecessary because I did not enjoy the random eating.

I even went out to lunch with my husband, and while I enjoyed his company, I was totally bored with the food because I was not hungry.

This may or may not be an important step for me in letting go of randomness, but I sure hope it is. I see there is very little joy in it and plenty of downside. I think maybe the S days are THE most important part of No S for me because in the past year I learned with my BODY and not with my head that no rules equals less freedom. Intellectual learning cannot compare.

I am very grateful for this painful experience! I am on my way to more freedom and enjoyment.

clarebear
Posts: 261
Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:54 am
Location: UK

Post by clarebear » Mon Nov 04, 2013 3:50 pm

I totally get what you mean FinallyFull!!
I am getting sick of the horrible feeling on and after S days. I have had this feeling before and then binged the week after and feeling like I haven't learnt my lesson but I really hope this weekend is different :oops:
Finally found a lifestyle change, not a diet!
Starting weight 167 lbs
Goal is to lose 20lbs in time for my wedding!

Kittykat150
Posts: 192
Joined: Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:29 pm

Post by Kittykat150 » Tue Nov 05, 2013 11:22 am

Sometimes the whole weekend gets blown, sometimes just one meal that doesn't end....but some weekends lately have been exactly like weekdays but with a little sweet at dinner. It will change like that. Not control of everything all at once, but slowly little chunks of sanity infiltrate your S days.
Kat
:wink:
"Never give up, for that is just the place and time that the tide will turn." -Harriet Beecher Stowe

jw
Posts: 844
Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 7:27 pm
Location: PA

Post by jw » Tue Nov 05, 2013 1:35 pm

Yes! this weekend was "obligatory food fest" at a potluck party with only baked goods on Saturday -- but I overdid it enough on Saturday evening that Sunday was just another N day -- not as self-punishment, I just couldn't face another dessert! A little "chunk of sanity!"

And I also faced that food test everyone talks about and I failed it -- a friend pushed a very large spiced pumpkin cupcake on me because she had made them and nobody had tried them yet and she was afraid they weren't good, could I please try one . . . I didn't know how to say no! It put me over the limit, though, and I don't care if I see another cupcake for months! Another "chunk of sanity" just in time for the holidays!
"The second you overcomplicate it is the second it becomes the thing for which it is a corrective." -- El Fug

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Tue Nov 05, 2013 2:22 pm

Mile marker: even throughout ups and downs with S days, I have come to a place where saying NO on N days is much quicker and more habit than ever before. I don't pause for a long time before saying no, I do it more quickly, in part because I have come to realize that the quicker I say no, the easier it is.

I can see that that moment of indecision is THE hardest part of moderation. Added up throughout the day, each time I am tempted and feel a pang of desire, it literally adds up to maybe ten or twenty seconds PER DAY! Once I've said no and moved away, the feeling is gone.

For instance, I was watching a movie and thought about a snack. I decided quickly "the movie is enough." Literally two seconds later I had forgotten ALL ABOUT it.

Have I really been a slave to twenty seconds of discomfort every day? That is very eye opening.

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Thu Nov 07, 2013 8:00 pm

My meals today are scheduled around my schedule at 9, 3 and 9 -- six hours apart, which is perfect for my body, but....

at 1:30 I was chilly, bored, stressed, tired, and hungry. I was also in the kitchen. What did I do? 14 minutes of anything! Lifted some hand weights, did a bunch of slow squats, some sit-ups, some stretches.

at 1:44 I was clear headed, warm enough to take my sweater off, calm, slightly energetic, and not hungry!!

Had I gone ahead and had lunch then, I would have been: sluggish, cold, probably still "hungry" due to stress, would have been superstarved or snacking well before dinner, and in a state of muscular atrophe.

Yay! In the case of "shovelglove", I think for me the short term pay-off might be even greater than the long-term payoff. Think I'll go post this in shovelglove

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Fri Nov 08, 2013 1:27 pm

Small "wins" everywhere. Had a chance for treats last night, but remembered that the real "treat" would be to save my appetite for dinner. And it was a real treat.

My mental habits of reframing things is getting stronger. The Great American Brainwash is slowly clearing up and I'm seeing Normal.

automatedeating
Posts: 4990
Joined: Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:16 pm

Post by automatedeating » Sat Nov 09, 2013 1:06 am

I love that saying: The real treat is saving my appetite for dinner!! That seems sticky, is it posted elsewhere?
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Sat Nov 09, 2013 1:03 pm

Not that I know of, but it's possible. :)

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Mon Nov 18, 2013 2:03 pm

I noticed years ago that "small" people tend to order small popcorn and small drinks at the movies. Took me until last night to do the same. The result: I was perfectly satisfied! By the time it was gone, I was too into the movie to even notice.

No more giant buckets for me.

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Wed Nov 20, 2013 2:42 pm

Another milestone, for me. Had the hardest N day for some reason, in the evening. I KNEW I was full, had a big lunch and even bigger dinner, but wanted very much to eat. I also really wanted a green day. So I nurtured myself in other ways, put on some warm jammies and slippers, found a good spot and a good book, had a mug of warm milk, chatted on the phone, and went to bed early. I made it without any snacking, despite many "brain attacks" that tried to get me to eat. I kept telling myself that I am building a habit, and I want that habit to be really solid.

No big deal to anyone else, but for me, I would always have caved in, thinking "who cares" -- and I don't care in the short term, and it wouldn't make me fat overnight BUT -- I have a new goal of building those trenches of new habit, and I really value that. I really value order, moderation, and savoring. No more "free for all" booby prize will fool me.

clarebear
Posts: 261
Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:54 am
Location: UK

Post by clarebear » Wed Nov 20, 2013 2:53 pm

brilliant finallyfull!!
it's these kinds of times that make us so strong so it's easier next time it happens!! :D
Finally found a lifestyle change, not a diet!
Starting weight 167 lbs
Goal is to lose 20lbs in time for my wedding!

automatedeating
Posts: 4990
Joined: Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:16 pm

Post by automatedeating » Wed Nov 20, 2013 4:02 pm

What an inspiring story! Thanks for sharing it.
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6

finallyfull
Posts: 354
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 6:10 pm

Post by finallyfull » Tue Nov 26, 2013 2:46 pm

I have found through repeated experience that in the evening, when my mind goes "shopping" for some little treat or drink, that I am truly satisfied with a glass of water.

That is SO not me! I would not have learned this without No S. But when I feel like having something, I have learned to check in with myself and see if a glass of water will do, and it very often turns out that I'm a little thirsty, then after I drink it, I don't want anything.

This would NEVER have worked as a tip early on. The water would have frustrated me by being so bland. But when I had months of habit built, the water suddenly seemed like a real option.

Doesn't mean I don't sometimes have some warm milk or even a glass of wine -- I sometimes do. But more frequently I have nothing at all, or water.

Lots of learning.

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